It used to be a popular map on starcraft/brood war, since then there have been several attempts to remake it for warcraft but all have could have been better.
This is how the gameplay basically works
- There are 5 colours/slots available/maximum players
- Each player gets units spawned every so often (30 seconds for example)
- By killing enemy units you get gold, the more gold you have the more and better units you get at each spawn interval
- You can use your gold for various things such as defense/upgrades/extra units/special units/buildings and World spells
- If you spend to much gold up you will go back down to less/crappy units spawning at each spawn interval so you have to spend it wisely.
Each colour is completely unique from the others, ill list the colours and what they are all about>
WHITE - White is the colour of law, order and structure. White magic heals and protects its creatures. Its main creatures are soldiers, clerics and angels. White mages prefer to send an army of smaller creatures into battle, but sometimes a single, awesome champion is necessary.
BLUE - Blue is the colour of the deep sea and the endless sky. The strength of blue magic lies in trickery and manipulation. Blue magic works behind the scenesm, scheming and stealing secrets, controlling their enviroments completely before making a move. The power of blue calls wizards and weird beasts of the air and oceans.
BLACK - Black mana comes from dank swamps, where things rester and rot. Death, disease, selfishness, power at any cost, these are the twisted values of darkness. Black magic is powerful and easy to wield but it comes with a high price. Its spells and abilities warp the mind, poison the land and turn creatues into nothing. Dark minions, undead creatures and unspeakable horrors are native to the swamp and they are as self-serving and treacherous as the mages who command them.
RED - Red mana comes from the mountains and the fiery heart of the world itself. Red magic is filled with fire, frenzy and storms of rock and lava. Its creatures are warlike and dangerous, ranging from mighty dragons to hordes of rampaging goblins. Mages who master red magic have no patience for talk or subtlety. they act quickly and recklessly. Red mages can channel their wild emotions to crush the ground you walk on or to wield flame like a living weapon.
GREEN - The teeming forests overflow with green mana, which represents the pulse of nature. Green magic is about growth, life and brute force. Green mages understand the wrold obeys the law of the jungle, everything is either predator or prey. Some green creatures are rich, living sources of mana, but no other colour can boast creatures as powerful. Green creatures are the biggest and mightiest around, from towering nature elements to carnivorous wurms.
continued>>|||Depending on which path you picked, at each spawn interval you would recieve units from that path. The more kills and gold you amassed the stronger and more powerful units you would get at your command. I have not yet fully determined the gold level requirements but it will most likely be something like this:-
- 0 gold needed to spawn tier 1 units
- 50 gold needed to spawn tier 2 units
- 150 gold needed to spawn tier 3 units
- 399 gold needed to spawn tier 4 units
- 500 gold needed to spawn tier 4 units
At the beginning of the game you may also pick a Hero to lead your armys. Each path will have 3 varying heroes but you may mix heroes with differnet paths so for example a Vampire hero may lead a Zombie army. However heroes will most likely be better suited for their own paths.
As the game progresses you can spend gold
- To call in extra units, these are generally slightly stronger and/or specialise in areas which can boost your armys
- Additional heroes, they are stronger than units but more expensive and slow your exp rate for other heroes in the area
- Items for heroes, they can turn your heroes into formiddable champions
- Upgrades/abilities - these can make your spawning units more capable and resilient.
- Buildings - these can spawn extra units, defend your area, or have other magical effects
- World Spells - these are the real power and win the games. You can steal peoples heroes, ressurect yours destroy buildings, massess of units, steal gold, manipulate your own gold etc. etc.
Obviously to win the game you need to kill the other players, the game is generally a 5player free for all and works best this way.
Continued>>|||So far we have done the following
- Created the map
- Theory behind 150 items (so far only 20 or so actually made in game)
- Theory behind 20 Heroes with 6 custom spells each (so far 3 heroes complete)
- Some of the paths are done others are still being "drawn out"
What we need
- Modellers/Skinners - mainly for each Hero
I can send pictures of how we want the heroes to look like and what they are based on.
- Advanced Spell/Ability makers - again mainly hero spells
I can send spell lists for browsing
If interested reply here or email me/msn me at Saldez@hotmail.co.uk
thx
Xev|||Wow! i am very interested and excited to play this map. I remember the good ol' days of starcraft playing this map. It was very fun and took skill to play. I would offer my services but unfortunately I dont have any experience in model making and i only have a basic trigger knowledge. www.wc3sear.ch has alot of models/skins/artwork that can be imported, some of which are actual MTG art formated for warcraft 3.
I remember in the old game the best players would just sit in their base and wait to be attacked the whole time, each time they were attacked they would get stronger and stronger. But in actual MTG this isnt how it works. Yes you can gain an advantage over your enemy if you succesfully defend because you would have more remaining troops, but you wouldnt actually get more mana and creatures. The classic starcraft way gives the winner (usually the defender, because they have gained more troops in the time it took you to goto their base) a double bonus advantage because they get more mana out of it and they have more remaining troops.
For this reason might i suggest a slightly different mana "gameplay mechanism". Maybe instead of getting creeps that spawn at intervals you get gold(mana) instead. and then you can choose which monsters to buy with that mana or you can choose to save. You could make a cooldown on the rate that you can buy units so people cant just summon a massive army at the last second when it is needed. This way there would be strategy in what composition your army was, not just the amount of army.
Also this would probably result in fewer total units in a battle (even though there would still be alot) which might be more fun and less stress on crappy computers. tons of 3d models can be hard to cope with. This and getting mana in intervals instead of creeps would make it seem more like the actual MTG.
With this system and a 5 person FFA, people would be very defensive though. So my idea to balance this is: you do get gold for killing other player's monsters but only when the killing is done out of your base. (i.e. in their base or in the center). That means you dont get gold from killing monsters while defending your base. This is more balanced i think because normally defenders have the advantage, not only because of more army but defensive stuctures too that can only be built in your base (in MTG terms: walls).
This would encourage attacking and make an offensive strategy and/or hero/path combination more viable. It isnt often in a free for all that the most aggresive wins, normally two fight and a third wins by killing the
remaining of the two. But it would be awesome if you could pull off a FFA game where aggresiveness is viable.
Now, for how to increase the amout of gold(mana) you get per increment, there are several ways to go:
1) you could buy it with your existing mana, which would be like Total Anihilation. This way time would be your biggest resource and you would have to balance army to more mana generation.
2) when picking your hero or path you could also sort of design your deck. You could pick if you wanted the cooldown on the rate that monsters became available to be higher or if you wanted your mana per increment to go up more often.
3) you could do a combo of the above two. You would get mana per increment and then you could use that mana to buy creatures at a shop (you could make the "shop" something more fitting with MTG, but shop works for discusion purposes). The shop would only get in new creatures for you to buy every so often though. Also one of the things you could be able to buy in the shop is more land-- more mana per increment). At the first of the game you could decide if you wanted the shop to get mana in for sell quicker or creatures (even which creatures if you wanted to go more in depth). This way you could design the flow of your deck and balance at the begining the land/creature ratio. you could even throw spells into the shop system too. This would give it a real MTG feel.
I have thought of makeing a map like this but i dont really have the MTG knowledge to. (I only played the actual card game some with my friend). If you have any ideas you want my opinion on, or would like to hear more of my opinions on something specific or more stuff in general, just let me know. I would love to help you in the idea generation department and then let you take whichever you like of them to add to your own ideas and then you do the balanceing and creating (the hard stuff
). I would also love to help you test it. even in a very unfinished preliminary (and buggy) state.If you do this really well it i bet it would be extremely popular. A Warcraft 3 version of MTG would be overwhelmingly fun to play if done right. The War3 editor has soooo much more potential than the starcraft one. expecially for fantasy settings (as opposed to Sci-Fi).
Sry for the long post, you might have gotten bored and not read it all, i know it was long.|||Quote:
I remember in the old game the best players would just sit in their base and wait to be attacked the whole time, each time they were attacked they would get stronger and stronger. But in actual MTG this isnt how it works. Yes you can gain an advantage over your enemy if you succesfully defend because you would have more remaining troops, but you wouldnt actually get more mana and creatures. The classic starcraft way gives the winner (usually the defender, because they have gained more troops in the time it took you to goto their base) a double bonus advantage because they get more mana out of it and they have more remaining troops.
Yes I played the starcraft/brood war versions many many times and I have given these things some thought.
- I intend to make it so theres a "mana battery" in the middle of the map that can be controlled if a hero stays on the beacon. By controlling it you will get mana per second. This should by itself force people to come to the middle and fight for control and preventing others from controlling the center.
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For this reason might i suggest a slightly different mana "gameplay mechanism". Maybe instead of getting creeps that spawn at intervals you get gold(mana) instead. and then you can choose which monsters to buy with that mana or you can choose to save. You could make a cooldown on the rate that you can buy units so people cant just summon a massive army at the last second when it is needed. This way there would be strategy in what composition your army was, not just the amount of army.
Well at the start of the map you can pick a hero and which path you want. So for example with white you can pick from Clerics/Soliders/Knights/Avens.
Im also not a big fan of enormous armys, thats why im not having large quantities of units spawning but rather a building producing 1 unit every 20 seconds or so. I intend to make the units with high life and quite low damage with plently of spells even the melee type units. This way players can micro more and have easier control over their units.
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With this system and a 5 person FFA, people would be very defensive though. So my idea to balance this is: you do get gold for killing other player's monsters but only when the killing is done out of your base. (i.e. in their base or in the center). That means you dont get gold from killing monsters while defending your base. This is more balanced i think because normally defenders have the advantage, not only because of more army but defensive stuctures too that can only be built in your base (in MTG terms: walls).
Well remember theres also lots of spells, enchantments and artifacts that can be used. On my map all enchantments/artifacts (which in general give big advantages) will be placed OUTSIDE of base out of defense range. So players will have to come out and defend buildings they buy.
Your deck idea is interesting and I was also thinking of some form of randomisation of spells/buildings or a method to choose them before game. But remember althought this is based on MTG its still warcraft, a computer strategy game. Therefore I think its best to have all spells available.
I dont intend to make the map a madness style map at all with 100s of 50hp units rushing to the middle to be slaughtered by hero spells like blizzard and flamestrike. Heroes will be quite strong but level slowly and if you buy a hero you wont be able to buy another one for atleast a few minutes.
thx for your respone, hopefully this clarifys the map more|||So if there's an advantage to holding the center, is it correct to assume that there would be no spells like Wrath of God or Ashes to Ashes? Because that'd be *** to control the center and have your hero blasted to smithereens. I also like said spells.|||Quote:
So if there's an advantage to holding the center, is it correct to assume that there would be no spells like Wrath of God or Ashes to Ashes? Because that'd be *** to control the center and have your hero blasted to smithereens. I also like said spells.
Yes but Wrath of God kills ALL creatures, including Whites creatures so it would make no difference on the location of your units.
There will be a few hero killer spells, but they will be expensive and players can always buy new heroes or buy items to protect them or cast spells to protect them.|||All creatures everywhere, eh? Well that's quite a tad different than SC, but i suppose all for the better. Otherwise it'd be unbalanced- hide every single one of your units in your base, wait for a grand melee, blast them to smithereens and have a slow, leisurely march to victory. Ah, those were the days.
Anyways, a couple of ideas.
______ Ones: From the Onslaught set, there were five tribal Avatars, one for each color. (Clerics, Wizards, Zombies, Goblins, and Elves, going clockwise) and their power/toughness was equal to the number of said tribal creatures in play. Though you are working on a smaller scale, the benefits from each creature could simply be boosted.
Alternate Win/Lose Conditions: Oh, joy. For some colors alternate win conditions would be difficult to figure out. You couldn't simply toss in the ones from the Odyssey block and be all right. Those wouldn't quite work out for some colors (Chance Encounter and Mortal Combat, for example. Test of Endurance might be a little iffy.) For Battle of Wits, Blue's alternate win condition, make it a gold requirement, of maybe 4500, or something incredibly high, depending on the scale of gold gaining. Epic Struggle would only require X amount of creatures. For Black you could use Lich. Exactly how it would work I don't know. Red could gain something along the lines of Final Fortune, a once-a-game uncounterable enchantment. If it's active when you die, you regain all life and something bad happens to your gold/creatures. White, instead of Test of Endurance, could have Celestial Convergence. Make Darksteel Reactor available to everybody. Anyways, that was just a couple of cents on what I'd like to see in the game. Do I really have any say? Nope. But I really hopethis turns out well. I could be a back-up idea person. I know Magic pretty well, and I'm kind of good with triggers too.|||Quote:
______ Ones: From the Onslaught set, there were five tribal Avatars, one for each color. (Clerics, Wizards, Zombies, Goblins, and Elves, going clockwise) and their power/toughness was equal to the number of said tribal creatures in play. Though you are working on a smaller scale, the benefits from each creature could simply be boosted.
You mean
- White - Doughtless One
- Blue - Nameless One
- Black - Soulless One
- Red - Reckless One
- Green - Heedless One
Yes to begin with im haveing a creature path from those 5 to begin with and 3 heroes for each path one of which being the above.
So for example
Black - Zombie path
Heroes - Undead Warchief / Rotlung Reanimator / Soulless One
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Alternate Win/Lose Conditions: Oh, joy. For some colors alternate win conditions would be difficult to figure out. You couldn't simply toss in the ones from the Odyssey block and be all right. Those wouldn't quite work out for some colors (Chance Encounter and Mortal Combat, for example. Test of Endurance might be a little iffy.) For Battle of Wits, Blue's alternate win condition, make it a gold requirement, of maybe 4500, or something incredibly high, depending on the scale of gold gaining. Epic Struggle would only require X amount of creatures. For Black you could use Lich. Exactly how it would work I don't know. Red could gain something along the lines of Final Fortune, a once-a-game uncounterable enchantment. If it's active when you die, you regain all life and something bad happens to your gold/creatures. White, instead of Test of Endurance, could have Celestial Convergence. Make Darksteel Reactor available to everybody. Anyways, that was just a couple of cents on what I'd like to see in the game. Do I really have any say? Nope. But I really hopethis turns out well. I could be a back-up idea person. I know Magic pretty well, and I'm kind of good with triggers too.
I was looking at those cards as well the other day. maybe I'll add them but for now I want to just keep it fairly simple with lots of heroes/units/items and spells so I can make the game playable before anything like that.
I was also looknig at the mirrodin stuff, thinking of some nice heroes with spells based around items. A Blue hero could have a nice steal item spell
|||The sticky at the top of the forum "Forming Mapping Teams:" clearly states that on-going discussion of your map(s) is not allowed in the forum. You can start another thread for recruiting only. But this one is done.
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